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Topic: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

A third pre-release of the latest UFX features is now available, see links below. News compared to pre-release 1 (http://www.rme-audio.de/forum/viewtopic.php?id=10764) and 2 (below):

- USB recording highly improved. Extended compatibility for lots of different USB devices, including USB 3 devices. Several performance improvements. Lots of bug fixes, too many to list them here.

- General: Lots of other bugfixes and improvements

- MIDI/remote: Lots of bugfixes and improvements, many based on the feedback we get here in the forum - thanks a lot!

Pre-release 6 and firmware 134 are our release candidates for next week. Most probably the Gain reduction display within the level meter bars will have to wait for the next release thereafter, sorry.

Text from pre-release 2: Some changes include improved handling of arming the tracks, Ctrl-click to arm/unarm all to the right, better info display and file handling, two Cue bugs fixed, and lots more. Note that the Record arm state as well as the Playback channels are no longer stored in the Snapshots, but within the Workspace, means these settings are global now for all 8 Snapshots.

Links:

Update 05/05/2011
UFX DSP firmware 134:
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/fu … c_pre3.zip
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/fu … n_pre3.zip

Latest drivers:
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/usb_win_0979.zip
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/fw_win_3044.zip

https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/fireface_x86.zip (Mac FireWire)

Update 05/06/2011
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/usb_mac_155.zip (includes the below 094pre6)

After driver installation replace TM FX with version 0.94pre6:
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/tm … _094_6.zip
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/tm … _094_6.zip
[Note for TM FX: File must be physically copied to the location of the previous version and replace it. Simply running the executable file will not do so. Copy the file to windows/system32 or the Programs folder on the Mac.]

Happy testing!

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

You guys rock !
I have a heavy schedule this weekend but I hope to find some time to try it.
Enjoy the weekend.
Reguards,
Mike

3 (edited by bsfreq 2011-04-22 01:52:07)

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Instead of "file system error" it now says Media/Device Error (after initializing!) with my "WD my passport essential SE 1TB" USB3 drive.
This time I formatted my FAT32 primary partition with EASEUS Partition Master that worked for Moshiko.

Option to send user defined names to mackie control is awesome!
But selecting submix (output bus on mackie control) still doesn't work!!  sad

Again, I have to go back to firmware 112 and tmfx 0.93 for now.

Fireface UFX+ | Fireface UFX | Babyface Pro | 12Mic

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Hi Matthias,
Thanks for the update.
A small bug:
I had an old file ufx01_00.wav, 2 hours long, on the HD.
I recorded two short new files and deleted them.
Now when going back to ufx01_00.wav and playing it, the timing trackbar shows incorrect max length of 13 seconds only.
Thanks and have a great weekend! smile

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Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

bsfreq wrote:

But selecting submix (output bus on mackie control) still doesn't work!!  sad

Thanks to the new mono channels there is no direct mapping anymore between input row and output row. Therefore we temporarily removed the ability to change the submix while in Input and Playback row. Got to Output row and it will work.

Please also note that you can now jump directly from Input to Output row (using the other direction). This makes it easier to go there for changing the submix or other settings.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

You can easily delete your whole post. First you overlooked the word 'temporarily', second direct submix via control change is there for a long time already. Check the docs.

Ok, my bad for not reading all the docs. And I guess the feature to change the submix while in input row will be added back to the final release.


Thank you and happy easter!

Fireface UFX+ | Fireface UFX | Babyface Pro | 12Mic

7 (edited by LiveAudio 2011-04-22 15:15:06)

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

bsfreq wrote:

Instead of "file system error" it now says Media/Device Error (after initializing!) with my "WD my passport essential SE 1TB" USB3 drive.
This time I formatted my FAT32 primary partition with EASEUS Partition Master that worked for Moshiko.

Same result for me with the same WD passport essential SE 1TB USB3.
I tried formating to Fat 32 with GUI format, Acronis, and  EASEUS including an all night disk wipe
to insure that there where were no hidden partitions.

I didn't spend too much time with TMFX. I have missing tray icons in both firewire and USB if I boot my computer with the UFX hooked to the bus and the UFX is turned on. If I boot the computer with the UFX connected to USB or firewire bus with the UFX off, then  turn the UFX on after booting, it seems OK. I'll retest that one next week.

Overall TMFX operation while connected to USB seemed smoother.

Thanks,
Mike

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Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

It is quite complicated and cumbersome to get 100% compatibility with a limited USB port design like in the UFX. It is no real computer, so to say, then things would be much easier. As you both have checked the partitions and there is no strange or hidden first one the most logical explanation at this time is that the drive draws too much current.

Can you please confirm your model to be exactly (!) this one:

http://www.amazon.de/Western-Digital-WD … B004445JKE

then we will get one to check.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

Can you please confirm your model to be exactly (!) this one:

http://www.amazon.de/Western-Digital-WD … B004445JKE

then we will get one to check.

Mine is WDBACX0010BBK-00. Seems to be the same drive, only different color.

Fireface UFX+ | Fireface UFX | Babyface Pro | 12Mic

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Same problem with my 500 GB Toshiba USB 3.0, formatted with Fat32Formatter:

http://www.amazon.com/Toshiba-Canvio-Po … amp;sr=8-2

The UFX message says "Initializing" for about 30 seconds, then "Media/Device Error!".

However, my Lexar USB sticks are now working!


Happy Friday,
Mike

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Direct submix select with midi works great!

I also noticed that you can activate the trim mode with midi command BC 66 xx.
This isn't a toggle on/off command and I don't know if this is intentional, but the behavior to my opinion is much better this way.
At least for controlling via midi. Now I can't accidentally go back to some other submix by pushing the trim mode button again.

There's just something wrong when selecting the trim mode this way. Everything works, but if I move any fader all the way down,
it stops responding at all.

I just found this by accident, and I know this isn't listed in your added features. Still.. if you're planning to make it work this way,
you definately got my full support! cool

Fireface UFX+ | Fireface UFX | Babyface Pro | 12Mic

12 (edited by LiveAudio 2011-04-23 05:58:10)

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

It is quite complicated and cumbersome to get 100% compatibility with a limited USB port design like in the UFX. It is no real computer, so to say, then things would be much easier. As you both have checked the partitions and there is no strange or hidden first one the most logical explanation at this time is that the drive draws too much current.

Can you please confirm your model to be exactly (!) this one:

http://www.amazon.de/Western-Digital-WD … B004445JKE

then we will get one to check.

Hello Matthias.

CONFIRMED: my drive is the WDBACX0010BBK-00, which should be the same drive, but in black .
If you type my model number in the Website that you linked to, my model will come up.

I understand and sympathize with the problems you are faced with. It may very well be some type of proprietary transport implementation/protocol that WD uses on this drive. I'm impressed with how hard you try to make everything as glitch free as possible.You guys are doing an outstanding job.

Thanks,
Mike

13

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

bsfreq wrote:

I also noticed that you can activate the trim mode with midi command BC 66 xx.
I just found this by accident, and I know this isn't listed in your added features.

UFX manual page 78:

Further functions:
- Trim Gains On: BC 66 xx (BC = MIDI channel 13, xx = any value)
- Trim Gains Off: BC 66 xx or select a submix

But the better way to do it is via 2D / 45 / A 2.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Hallo,
ist es möglich die Record und Start/Stop Funktion per Midi zu steuern? Das wäre ein tolles Feature, um nicht ständig für Aufnahmen an das UFX zu gehen. Die Steuerung per Midi wäre eine coole Funktion.
Grüße
Oliver

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Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Später.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Whoops, it looks like I mis-applied the directions on how to do this properly, and now TotalMix FX refuses to run. Sorry to have to ask, but can I start from the begining by uninstalling everything and then re-installing from the disk that came with the UFX without making things worse?
Thanks,
           Stephen

17

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

You did not copy the newer TM FX after driver installation. That's all.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

18 (edited by Airlock 2011-04-24 01:19:09)

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

You did not copy the newer TM FX after driver installation. That's all.

Thank you!

Okay, all is well with TM FX, and I played back a wav. file from a USB stick. The playback at first was a very loud static; I then advanced the playback position and the file did start to play normally, but it would not start the file from the beginning. Repeated tries yielded the same results. Could that be the USB stick or my lack of skills?HeadScratch

OCZ Rally2 4GB USB 2.0 Flash Drive

Thanks!

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Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

All the info you need is in this and the former rec thread in this forum. HD Load, Write time...

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

20 (edited by bsfreq 2011-04-24 12:14:08)

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:
bsfreq wrote:

I also noticed that you can activate the trim mode with midi command BC 66 xx.
I just found this by accident, and I know this isn't listed in your added features.

UFX manual page 78:

Further functions:
- Trim Gains On: BC 66 xx (BC = MIDI channel 13, xx = any value)
- Trim Gains Off: BC 66 xx or select a submix

But the better way to do it is via 2D / 45 / A 2.

Haha, yeah I had an older version of the manual, that's why I didn't know.  smile
2D / 45 / A 2 works exactly the same way as choosing the trim mode via mackie control.
It's a toggle on/off button, so pressing once turns the trim mode on, and pressing again turns it off. (back to previously selected submix)
I was wondering if it would be possible to make a midi command that only turns the trim mode on, not off.
Then it would be same as choosing a submix, and it would stay on, even if I accidentally push the trim mode button again.


I can't see my tmfx window when I play, because I have to keep my ableton live window up front. So knowing for sure when I turn
the trim mode on would help me A LOT!

Anyway I definately got to give you credit for your support. It's just awesome! After using motu products for a few years and
many times waiting for almost 6 months for the reply (that most of the times didn't even answer my questions). Your support is totally
from another planet. And awesome work with the updates, thanks for listening to what we need! :-)

Fireface UFX+ | Fireface UFX | Babyface Pro | 12Mic

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Hi, I'm getting 'no Media Detected' in the UFX if I format a Sony 16GB USB stick to FAT32 using either Fat32Formatter or the format disk facility in Windows 7 Home Premium. Model is Sony USM16GL. UFX is running latest v1.33 firmware. Seems to recognise something is plugged into the USB port as the 'record/playback' screen comes up but thats as far as it goes. Any ideas? Thanks.

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Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

bsfreq, thanks for the nice words.

ufxuser, you can wait for the next firmware, we are constantly improving compatibility. Of course you could also get yourself a stick that just works. See my earlier comment about the Sony MicroVault 16 GB. I found two tests online that claim your stick's write rate is below 5 MB/s. Trash it...

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Thanks Matthias. Time to get another stick..

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

I  think this is exactly the problem. Tried this drive with a WD TV HD and it also cannot run the drive via bus power.

MC wrote:

...the most logical explanation at this time is that the drive draws too much current.

Can you please confirm your model to be exactly (!) this one:

http://www.amazon.de/Western-Digital-WD … B004445JKE

Regards,
Jeff Petersen
Synthax Inc.

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

...Of course you could also get yourself a stick that just works...

Might I suggest a sticky with known good and reported bad USB and HDD devices (by model number)? 

Thanks,
Mike

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Jeff wrote:

I  think this is exactly the problem. Tried this drive with a WD TV HD and it also cannot run the drive via bus power.

MC wrote:

...the most logical explanation at this time is that the drive draws too much current.

Can you please confirm your model to be exactly (!) this one:

http://www.amazon.de/Western-Digital-WD … B004445JKE

Jeff,

I did a lot of research on this drive over the last few days, and while the power may very well be the issue,
there seems to be a lot of problems with this drive regarding the VCD. I have mixed info concerning this.

Many say that using software that we've all tried WILL eliminate the VCD, but some guys claim that the VCD
is in the firmware, and that it causes problems.

I'm interested in RME's findings as to what the culprit is, and if we should all just pass on this drive.
I agree with Mikey_45 that at some point we should get an "approved" drive list.

Thanks,
Mike

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

LiveAudio wrote:

I agree with Mikey_45 that at some point we should get an "approved" drive list.

I believe such a list will be hard to maintain... Products change and vary too fast, and regional availability may differ...


Regards,
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

28

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Also the manufacturers change the inside of their sticks all the time without changing the part number. Such a list would be misleading quickly.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

29 (edited by LiveAudio 2011-04-27 00:29:08)

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

I believe such a list will be hard to maintain... Products change and vary too fast, and regional availability may differ...

Daniel:
Also the manufacturers change the inside of their sticks all the time without changing the part number. Such a list would be misleading quickly.

Understood, thanks.

I'm curious to see if you can get it that WD drive work though...
If you can't I'll just use it for backup.

Regards,
Mike

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Shouldn't be any more difficult than a manufacturer of a sequencing program cataloging audio interfaces (like the UFX) that work with their software.  A simple list of what has been tested at RME would do the trick.  And I believe the alternatives are either to ensure that all popular USB devices work with the UFX (which seems like a more daunting task than a simple list), or to simply remain silent on the issue, letting your customers try different devices until one works (which seems less friendly than what I've seen so far in RME).

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Seems you did not get the point. A Fireface UFX will be a Fireface UFX. But an OCZ flash drive may be totally different just months after we test it, even the same capacity or model number. And then we test it ok, and it doesn't work when you buy it later, and then what?

It might work with very specific model numbers of hard drives, but even here, external USB enclosures may vary. And with products of a rather short lifespan like USB sticks, it is rather pointless, really.


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Well, I understood your point quite clearly - though I assume we're discussing issues, and not personalities.  I disagree with it though, for what that's worth.  What you're offering is the absence of information, generally a bad thing when marketing $2000 pro hardware.  What I'm advocating is telling it like it is - "Here's what we tested.  Your mileage may vary".  I am just one customer, one who is frankly a little surprised by the harshness of some of your company's representatives responses here.  Time will tell if others share my feelings, I guess.  I have found a personal storage solution, so I am happy for my own uses.  I just assumed the word "beta" meant you wanted me to voice my opinion in general...

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

mikey_45 wrote:

Shouldn't be any more difficult than a manufacturer of a sequencing program cataloging audio interfaces (like the UFX) that work with their software.  A simple list of what has been tested at RME would do the trick.  And I believe the alternatives are either to ensure that all popular USB devices work with the UFX (which seems like a more daunting task than a simple list), or to simply remain silent on the issue, letting your customers try different devices until one works (which seems less friendly than what I've seen so far in RME).

There's a need, for sure. Just the question of how to resolve it.

Back in the day (long long ago) I used to integrate animation workstations and NLE's.
Not many drives could handle the data, so people like myself used to buy ,test and sell
the drives. firmware revisions used to be a big issue.The micropolis 4221 AV gold was "the" drive.
So resellers/integrators/vars solved the need for compatible drives.

Of course, back then a 4221 was about 1000.00 per gig if memory serves, so there was room to charge
for your testing. At 100.00 per TB, not much room !

Maybe we can get a list together at a forum like Gearslutz. Something like the Pro tools 9 Win 7 PC build list at the DUC forum. Members could update/revise it as we go.
Just a thought for any brave soul with some free time on his hands...

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

I think that in this forum we should have a topic of working usb sticks and HD(s). People can update it regularly to see what currently is working.
            regards Allen

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

I just did a recording this weekend 10 tracks, @ 48k for 3 1 hour sets. The 2nd set the HD (western digital Scorpio Black WD5000BEKT 500GB ) stopped recording 25 min. into set third set was fine. There were no drop outs but once in a while I could hear slight pops. The Hd was in an external enclosure (COOLMAX HD-250C-eSATA Aluminum 2.5" Copper USB & eSATA External Enclosure)
  Any thoughts?
             thanks Allen

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

+1

Unofficial "user based" working / nonworking usb media sticky on the forum would be just fine I guess.

Regards,

     b.

https://granurise.com

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Great stuff.  Could even be self-service, with a little ingenuity, so it would require little maintenance.  It's just that, if I were looking for such information, I'd go to the manufacturer of the product, probably not to GS or the like.  But, you take your best shot, and move on...

38

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

A list like that makes no sense as long as we are still improving the UFX compatibility. Of course we hope to get (nearly) everything working. Just wait a little.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

At this stage it makes no sense, ofcourse. But once usb recording is ready for general public, a list like that would help A LOT to know which usb media works best / worse / not at all...

Cheers,

       b.

https://granurise.com

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Again, product life cycles and technical differences or updates even within products of the same brand may make it difficult to guarantee compatibility..

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

A list like that makes no sense as long as we are still improving the UFX compatibility. Of course we hope to get (nearly) everything working. Just wait a little.

THAT I can understand, and makes perfect sense to me.  If there's anything I can do to help (for example, the debugging log I discussed with you) I'll be happy to do so.  I have about a gajillion (to put it techncally) old drives and USB sticks laying around.  Am very pleased with the audio quality - during gigs, when I record and playback, it sounds like I'm still playing and singing.  Perfect for cutting live tracks, or sound checks.  When I want to use it as the hub of my studio, it's equally adept at that, and I have a backup recording for insurance.  Will look forward to seeing the capabilities and product maturity grow...

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

I formatted Samsung HD103SJ (1000GB, 7200rpm, 32M) with Fat32Formatter.
The 3min30s test recording went well and there wasn't any errors detected.
HD usage was around 35%.

Sonicimage studio
RME FF UFX, XTC, ADI-648, MADIface USB
W10 Pro 64bit

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Also Seagate Barracuda 7200, 12, 1TB formatted and recorded without errors.

Old Sandisk SDCZ34-004G didn't perform that well, 40s test record maxed at 92% and there was 8 errors.

Sonicimage studio
RME FF UFX, XTC, ADI-648, MADIface USB
W10 Pro 64bit

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Jayzteroid wrote:

I formatted Samsung HD103SJ (1000GB, 7200rpm, 32M) with Fat32Formatter.
The 3min30s test recording went well and there wasn't any errors detected.
HD usage was around 35%.

Thanks for the info. I need to buy another drive as my WD USB3 is shelved for now.
What type of enclosure did you use? Was it self powered or bus powered?

Thanks,
Mike

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

A list like that makes no sense as long as we are still improving the UFX compatibility. Of course we hope to get (nearly) everything working. Just wait a little.

We're waiting...Like Kids waiting for Christmas !
The USB function is a great tool.I'm sure that you understand our enthusiasm (and hence the urgency).
View it as a compliment that we're all so gung-ho about the UFX feature set :-)

Regards,
Mike

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

I use this one:
http://www.forcomtech.com.tw/data/fudse30.pdf

Its a selfpowered dock for SATA.

Sonicimage studio
RME FF UFX, XTC, ADI-648, MADIface USB
W10 Pro 64bit

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Jayzteroid wrote:

I use this one:
http://www.forcomtech.com.tw/data/fudse30.pdf

Its a selfpowered dock for SATA.

Thanks. I'm thinking that using a case with power supply is the way to go.
It will increase compatibility, not to mention that you can remove and store the drive.

Thanks,
Mike

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Mikey-45,

Sorry to go slightly off topic, but were you the guy that tried the UFX with Vegas 10?
I'm getting ready to upgrade to that, so if you have any insite, please PM me.

Thanks,
Mike

49

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

Just a heads up: we got the WD USB 3 drive and already got it working. We also fixed another problem in our routines that will (again) improve the overall compatibility. New firmware coming soon.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

50 (edited by LiveAudio 2011-04-28 21:14:09)

Re: Fireface USB recording - public pre-release 3

MC wrote:

Just a heads up: we got the WD USB 3 drive and already got it working. We also fixed another problem in our routines that will (again) improve the overall compatibility. New firmware coming soon.

Wow ! I was just going to exchange that drive. You guys are fast !
What was the issue ?

Regards,
Mike